Foreign Relations of the United States, 1961–1963, Volume VII, Arms Control and Disarmament

263. Memorandum of Conversation⁰

Washington, February 9, 1963, 3 p.m.

SUBJECT

• Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons

PARTICIPANTS

• The Secretary
• Anatoliy F. Dobrynin, Soviet Ambassador
• John C. Guthrie, Director, SOV

The Secretary expressed the hope that it might be possible to agree at Geneva not only on a nuclear test ban but on other aspects of disarmament as well.¹ He had spoken to the President this morning concerning the Ambassador’s call on February 7 at which time non-proliferation had been discussed² and he wished to repeat that at this stage the Soviets are still “boxing shadows” on this issue. The Soviets are concerned about something which is not yet in being. Furthermore, we make a real distinction between a multilateral force and national nuclear forces. This idea of extending national capabilities is not United States policy and is contrary to our own interests.

Ambassador Dobrynin asked when the Soviet Government might expect an official reply to their approaches on United States attempts to establish a multilateral force.

The Secretary replied that there were many complex questions involved and that it would be some time before there was an official reply. With regard to the Nassau Agreement, the United Kingdom and United States will assign some national forces to NATO but these assignments did not involve the question of the non-proliferation of nuclear weapons.

The Ambassador said that speaking personally it appeared as though the United States Government was asking the Soviet Government to sit still while the United States completed a long negotiation with its allies on a multilateral nuclear force. Only then did the United States intend to deal with the Soviet concerns.

The Secretary said he thought he could clarify our position on this matter. We are now waiting to hear from the French Government on the subject of the multilateral force. We also believe that it is important for France to be a signatory to the first part of our proposed treaty on the non-transfer of nuclear weapons since the French have an atomic capability. When we get the French answer and assuming that it is positive, then we can talk with the Soviets and work out a treaty on non-proliferation in detail. We do not need to wait for the multilateral force agreement to be completed before reaching agreement on non-transfer with the Soviets. Indeed, a Four Power agreement on this subject could, in the Secretary’s opinion, be reached before the conclusion of an agreement with our allies on a multilateral force.

0. Source: Department of State, Central Files, DEF 18-6. Secret; Eyes Only. Drafted by Guthrie and approved in S on February 13. The meeting was held in the Secretary’s office.
1. Reference is to the talks at the Eighteen-Nation Disarmament Committee, which were to resume in Geneva on February 12.
2. Regarding Dobrynin’s February 7 meeting with the Secretary, see Document 261. Secretary Rusk met with the President from 11 to 11:30 a.m. on February 9 (Kennedy Library, President’s Appointment Book), but no account of their conversation has been found.