Office of the Historian

114. Memorandum of Conversation1

SecDel/MC/43
New York, December 19, 1964, 11 a.m.

SUBJECT

  • Syria-Israel Conflict
[Page 251]

PARTICIPANTS

  • U.S.
    • The Secretary
    • Ambassador Yost
    • Mr. Newberry
  • Foreign
    • Dr. Hassan Muraywid, Minister for Foreign Affairs of Syria
    • Dr. Rafik Asha, Permanent Representative to U.N.
    • Dr. Jawdat Mifti, Minister, Charge d’Affaires, Washington

The Secretary opened the discussion by telling the Minister that the U.S. policy toward Syria was one of support for the independence, security and prosperity of Syria. The Minister reciprocated the Secretary’s comment. The Minister went on to express the pleasure of the Syrian Government and the Syrian people in the re-election of President Johnson. The Syrians, he said, felt that the Johnson Administration showed good understanding of the aspirations of national liberation movements. He also remarked on the great understanding shown by the U.S. in the current Security Council discussion of Syria’s complaint against Israel.2

The Secretary said that it was unfortunate that Israel had moved the tractor into the zone in the first place; it was unfortunate that the Syrians had begun shooting; and it was unfortunate that the incident escalated as it did. The Minister noted that there was no precedent for an aerial attack of the sort mounted by Israel. The Security Council had not been able to deal with it and it was clear that the U.N. machinery in the area must be enabled to cope with such problems. The Syrian Govenment was insistent on remapping and marking the entire demarcation line as recommended in para. 45 of the report of the UNTSO Chief of Staff (August 23, 1963). The marking could, of course, be done step-by-step but unless the entire line is remapped, incidents might recur indefinitely. Dr. Mufti interjected that if the remapping were to be done only in the northern sector, Israel might later be unwilling to consider doing the same in other areas.

Later in the conversation the Minister returned to the subject of Arab-Israel relations in general, stating that he would be derelict in his duty to his Government and to other Arabs unless he expressed to the Secretary the grave feelings of the Arabs in the face of Israel’s long-term expansionist and hostile aims. The Minister spoke at length of the inculcation in the minds of Israeli young people of hostile attitudes [Page 252] toward Arabs. This mentality, when associated with Israel’s projects in the field of nuclear research filled the Arabs with great foreboding.

The Secretary responded by affirming that the U.S. was opposed to territorial expansion and the spread of nuclear weapons. The Secretary then asked the Minister what kind of situation might prevail if, hypothetically, the element of fear might be removed on both sides, noting that the Israelis also had occasion for their fear since they understood that many Arabs thought of Israel as a people marked for destruction. The Minister replied that it was not possible to conceive of such a situation given the present activities of the Israelis.

The Secretary reminded the Minister of the U.S. efforts to restrict the spread of nuclear weaponry. When the Minister expressed a fear that Israel might be able to acquire nuclear weapons through the private sector, the Secretary expressed doubt that such a thing was possible and assured the Minister that the U.S. Government watches every aspect of nuclear production very closely.

The Secretary told the Minister that the two of them would keep in touch on the matters they had been discussing. He remarked that Ambassador Ridgway Knight was an old friend of his and noted that Ambassador Knight had a direct channel of communication which the Minister could avail himself of whenever he had a personal message for the Secretary.

  1. Source: National Archives and Records Administration, RG 59, Central Files 1964–66, POL 32–1 ISR–SYR. Confidential. Drafted by Daniel O. Newberry of the Office of Near Eastern, South Asian Regional Affairs and approved in S on December 24. The memorandum is marked Part I of III; Parts II and III are ibid., Conference Files: Lot 66 D 110, CF 2449. The meeting was held at the U.S. Mission at the United Nations.↩
  2. Both Israel and Syria had requested an urgent meeting of the Security Council following an outbreak of fighting on the Israeli-Syrian border on November 13. The Security Council considered the complaints at nine meetings between November 16 and December 21. Documentation concerning the discussions at the United Nations is ibid., Central Files 1964–66, POL 32–1 ISR–SYR/UN.↩