Office of the Historian

105. Memorandum of Conversation0

Washington, July 17, 1961.

SUBJECT

  • Export of Research Equipment to Soviet Bloc

PARTICIPANTS

  • Secretary Hodges, Mr. Behrman and Mr. George (Commerce)
  • Secretary Rusk and Mr. Whitman (State)
  • Secretary McNamara (Defense)
  • Chairman Seaborg (A.E.C.)
  • Mr. Dryden (NASA)
  • Mr. Guthe and Mr. Weber (C.I.A.)

Mr. Hodges presented the questions of (1) any desirable change in policy on export of research equipment to the Soviet bloc and (2) the specific case of a Van de Graaff accelerator for Poland.

Mr. Rusk stated the U.S. position as one of openness and cooperation in basic science. Science is inherently international in character. Many of the true scientists in bloc countries are not political and to this extent they offer a constructive contact. The Rockefeller Foundation Science Project with Polish scientists exemplifies a healthy enterprise.

We should not change policy at this time just because of a potential Berlin crisis. If the crisis should require certain restrictive actions in the future, they would be made by policy decision at the time.

Policy might dictate some selectivity between different countries of the bloc group, e.g. Poland over the U.S.S.R. and Rumania over Bulgaria. [Page 269] He suggested that Whitman might help the Export Control people if such an issue arises. He added that the Government should not urge a manufacturer to sell equipment to a bloc country against his wishes. He ended with the observation that attempts to restrict pure science might resemble the tale of King Canute and the Tide. He then left the meeting but returned later.

Mr. McNamara said that, while pure research of course may have an effect on military capability, the Department of Defense should object to export only if the proposed shipment added a substantial increment of military power. Otherwise, political considerations were the dominant factors and the State Department should therefore be the judge. He believed that the Department of Defense has in the past been much too restrictive about exports of scientific equipment.

He recommended that a 30-day time limit be established for giving a Yes or No answer after a request for an export license has been received, pointing out the disadvantage of long-delayed decisions when the real issues are political.

Mr. Hodges commented that the working group in Commerce should not make decisions between different bloc countries on their own judgment and that they should expect guidance from State on such policy matters. He anticipated that a decision to ship the accelerator to Poland would bring criticism but he was quite willing to take it if he were assured of support. Mr. Rusk, Mr. McNamara and Dr. Seaborg volunteered support.

Mr. Hodges then announced that (1) shipment of the accelerator will be approved, (2) he is satisfied that basic policy should not be changed at this time and (3) the 30-day time limit proposed by Mr. McNamara is to be adopted.

  1. Source: Department of State, Central Files, 460.119/7-1761. Secret. Drafted by Walter Whitman, Science Advisor in the Department of State, and approved in S on July 20.↩