500.A4/190½
Memorandum by the Secretary of State of a Conversation with the British Ambassador (Geddes), September 20, 1921
The Ambassador called by appointment, made at his request.
The Ambassador said he had been instructed by his Government to say that Mr. Lloyd George would be unable to attend the Conference; that Mr. Lloyd George wished to express his deep regret that he could not do so but that the situation in Great Britain was such that he could not be away for the length of time necessary even to attend the Conference for a part of its session; that even if the Irish question was settled there were other matters which would make it impossible for him to leave. The Ambassador added that Mr. Lloyd George was not well and did not feel that he could take the additional burden of the Conference.
The Secretary expressed his regret that Mr. Lloyd George could not come and remarked that the Prime Minister probably did not realize the warmth of the welcome that he would receive and that the Secretary thought that his presence here would do much more toward cementing British-American relations than any number of discussions; that the American people would be very glad to greet the only Prime Minister who had officially survived the War. The Ambassador said that he felt this was very true and that he had urged Mr. Lloyd George to come and still hoped that he might be able to come for a part of the Conference.
The Ambassador said that he was also instructed to say that the British would probably desire to send five or six delegates; that this would be necessary to give the Dominions the representation; they felt it also desirable to have India represented and that he would advise the Secretary further as soon as he had further information upon this point.
The Secretary said that the number had been fixed at four with a desire to meet the British point of view; that we had been advised that Lord Curzon wanted two or three; that it was impossible for this Government, in order to give the Senate proper representation, to have less than four, and that we had held the number down to this point solely because of the British suggestion. The Secretary said, further, that this had been announced because it was thought, after [Page 72] communication with Ambassador Harvey, that this course was satisfactory to the British Government, but that of course this Government would be very glad to have as large a delegation as Great Britain wished to send and was particularly glad to know that the Dominions would be represented.
The Ambassador said that he had several questions from his Government which he thought he could answer himself but he would bring some of them up. He then referred to the topic on the Agenda—“Rules for the Control of New Agencies of Warfare” and inquired as to what was intended. The Secretary said that it referred especially to the use of gas, aircraft and submarines. The Ambassador said that he thought it quite important that the subject should be discussed but doubted whether it was practicable to frame any rules which would govern the matter. The Secretary said that he appreciated the difficulty and was not prepared to say that it would be advisable to frame such rules; that it was quite possible that if the Conference desired to take up the matter, it might wish to appoint an expert commission to consider the matter and report either to the several governments or at a later conference, but that it was deemed to be wise where we were meeting in conference that this subject should not be excluded from the agenda, in order that there might be a general discussion of it if the representatives of the Powers desired to undertake such a discussion. The Ambassador agreed that this was advisable.
The Ambassador inquired with regard to the order of procedure. He said he understood that the procedure to be adopted was that of the Supreme Council. The Secretary said that this was true but it would be necessarily modified by the fact that the Supreme Council had been more or less continuous in its activity and that it met from time to time to discuss particular subjects which were prepared in advance by the expert advisers of the governments; that in this way they came to a meeting of the Council more definitely prepared than would be possible in connection with the coming Conference, which was meeting for the first time. The Secretary said that for this reason he thought it might be found advisable to appoint committees who would consider the various questions and make reports to the Conference. The Ambassador asked whether it was intended to take up the subject of limitation of armament before the Pacific and Far Eastern problems. He said that he thought it would be impossible to deal with the limitation of naval armament at all until the Pacific problems had been considered and an understanding reached.
The Secretary said that he fully appreciated the importance of reaching an understanding as to Pacific and Far Eastern problems, [Page 73] but he thought that instead of evoking the criticism that might attach to an indefinite postponement of the question of limitation of armament, a committee might be created which could be considering all the technical and expert questions involved while the matter of Pacific and Far Eastern problems was under consideration, so that when an opportune time was reached the material would be ready for submission to the Conference. The Secretary said he did not think that it was necessary technically to postpone all the work upon a given subject until another subject had been completed.
The Secretary also pointed out that there would be collateral opportunities in connection with the Conference for meetings of all the representatives of the various Powers in an informal way. This would give the opportunity for some of the representatives of Great Britain and Japan and the United States to discuss the questions quite informally and apart from the regular meetings of the Conference; that this would have all the advantages that the British sought to have in a preliminary conference, and if it was possible for the governments to reach a common understanding they could do it quite as well in that way as at any other time.
The Ambassador said that he had been instructed by his Government to say that they were satisfied with the proposed agenda save that they desired to add the subject of the Panama Canal tolls.
The Secretary said that he did not think it advisable that this subject should be brought into the Conference; that in his opinion it was a matter to be dealt with diplomatically between the Governments of Great Britain and the United States.
The Ambassador said that it was the view of his Government that it was a question not alone between Great Britain and the United States but affecting other governments and so would appropriately be brought into the Conference.
The Secretary said that his Government approached the Conference in a complete spirit of friendship and the utmost desire to see if subjects of controversy could be removed; that in this view it was necessary, however, that the Powers should deal at this time with the subjects that were presented in the Far East. The Secretary referred to the Anglo-Japanese Alliance and the way in which it was regarded in this country. The Secretary said that the time had come when the constant sentiments and cordial expressions which were made at dinners and on various occasions with respect to the friendly cooperation of the two Governments should be translated into something definite; …
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The Ambassador asked whether progress had been made in connection with Yap sufficient to enable a public statement to be made. [Page 74] The Secretary said that the matter was in the course of negotiations; that a settlement had not been reached; that there had been a virtual agreement on many points and he hoped the matter would soon be concluded and he would be in a position to make a statement regarding it.
The Ambassador asked whether the Secretary thought the Treaty with Germany made it necessary to have any treaty between the United States and the other Powers. The Secretary said that he did not think so, except with respect to the mandated territories; that in other matters the United States, through its Treaty with Germany, was put on the same basis as the other Powers, and that he assumed that none of the other Powers would have any objection to its taking this view. The Ambassador intimated that there was no objection so far as Great Britain was concerned. The Secretary said that with respect to mandated countries there were certain rights possessed by the United States and that the question of title could not be cleared up except by a suitable convention between the United States and the other Principal Allied and Associated Powers to whom Germany had ceded her former possessions. The Secretary said he had made suggestions as to the provisions of mandates and his thought was that after these had been threshed out a convention could be entered into by which the United States would receive the benefit of the engagements of the other Powers with respect to the mandated possessions and to have equal privileges and open-door opportunities which had been referred to in the Secretary’s Note.